Irie vs. Irate
‘Murder music’ forum brings protesters, promoters together in search of one love
(March 4, 2010) Last Wednesday evening, a group of gay rights advocates, concert promoters, venue owners, politicians and media scribes gathered in an oval of uncomfortable chairs on the dance floor at Aunty Mo’s in Eureka. For many in attendance, the discomfort likely had more to do with the topic of conversation than the chairs.
In the past six months, threats of protest have effectively canceled shows by dancehall bad boys Buju Banton, Bounty Killer and Capleton, all of whom have been called out for their violent gay-bashing lyrics (“The Hum,” Oct. 8, 2009). This series of confrontations has put everyone involved on edge. Venue owners and concert promoters feel they’ve been bullied and intimidated. Many were evidently unaware that the artists in question were controversial until they started receiving angry e-mails and phone calls — not all of them civil. LGBT (lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender) rights advocates, meanwhile, steadfastly refuse to roll out the red carpet for dudes whose lyrics call for their torture, mutilation and murder. Last week’s forum, organized by the Humboldt Equality Coalition, a Voltron-like alliance of local LGBT advocacy groups, was an attempt to find common ground.
Among the attendees were Arcata City Councilman Shane Brinton, Fourth District Supervisor Bonnie Neely and Fifth District candidate Patrick Cleary. Co-organizer Todd Larsen, who founded the group Queer Humboldt with partner Michael Weiss in 2003, said the last six months have put their group in a bad light. Getting the shows canceled was the right thing to do, he said, but after three in a row, “We’re thinking, ‘Oh great, we’re Queer Humboldt: concert cancelers. That’s all we need to be known as.’”
Larsen, Weiss and “Humboldt Against Hate” blogger Mitch Trachtenberg argued that this is not a reggae/dancehall issue or even an LGBT issue, per se, but rather a matter of community standards. “It just doesn’t seem like a big request to find people who are not singing, anywhere, about killing people,” Trachtenberg said.
A good rule of thumb, perhaps, but some context on the specifics here is illuminating. The riddim of Jamaica, unfortunately, does not always follow the “One Love” tenets of the late, great Bob Marley. Buju Banton, Bounty Killer and Capleton have each recorded songs that overtly suggest murdering gay men, whether by drowning, shooting, burning or stabbing. Lest this be dismissed as post-modern irony or, as some have argued, metaphorical indictments of child abusers, consider that in 2004 Banton was implicated in the violent beating of six gay men in his native Jamaica, where at least 35 gay men have been murdered since 1997 according to Amnesty International. (Banton was eventually acquitted — suspiciously, some say — due to a lack of evidence.) Numerous media accounts have described crowds gathered in celebration around the mutilated bodies following such murders. Human rights groups have dubbed Jamaica the most homophobic place on earth.
Some business owners and promoters, as well as many disgruntled reggae fans, have argued that you can’t fight hate with hate. By forcing cancellation of these acts, they say, protesters are the ones showing intolerance — infringing on the artists’ rights to free speech. Sheryl Bybee, promoter and publicist for the Reggae Rising festival, further suggested that allowances should be made for religious and moral relativism. “Everyone has a different outlook depending on your belief system,” she said. “If your belief system is the Bible then what these guys are doing is not wrong… .” (This comment prompted a mass sprouting of raised hands.)
Gil Miracle, whose Eureka venue, Nocturnum, was targeted by protesters for agreeing to host Banton, said that while he agrees with protesters (and, incidentally, the Supreme Court) that free speech shouldn’t extend to threats of violence, the events of recent months have left a bad taste in his mouth. Protesters may be exercising their own free speech rights, he said, but the effect hardly differs from outright censorship. “The last thing I can afford is to have some truly homophobic douchebag come inside [Nocturnum] and get trashed, then go out and pick a fight with some protesters,” he told the Journal last week. Threats of protest leave him with no options but cancellation, he said. At the meeting Miracle suggested a different approach. “The way we do it is we strong-arm these guys [like Banton] into trying to clean up their act.” Specifically he recommended telling such performers that if they launch into a gay-bashing song their show will promptly be shut down.
Lara Cox, who owns the Arcata Theatre Lounge with her husband Brian, was skeptical of that approach. Bounty Killer’s promoter suggested that very thing, she said, but she dismissed the idea as impractical. “I’m hard put to stop the show at end of night,” she said. Pull the plug mid-song and, “We’ll probably have a riot on our hands.”
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61 Comments
Comment / By Jessica Pettitt / March 4, 6:18 a.m.
If anyone is interested in being a part of the on-going discussions, please send me an email at jess@iamsocialjustice.com and you will be included on the listserv where the next meeting details will soon be discussed.
Comment / By Mitch Trachtenberg / March 4, 6:54 a.m.
Thank you, Ryan Burns, for spelling out the facts of these singers’ lyrics without candy-coating or preceding your description with “context-setting”.
I’m especially thankful that you had the decency to quote Sheryl Bybee, letting your readership know the way in which Reggae promoters have been presenting the issue.
Congrats to the headline writer, too.
Comment / By Make amends / March 4, 3:24 p.m.
I like the activist who said it’s a bright line.
It is. If you call for my death, you have to retract your words and apologize. Otherwise, i’ll be out protesting you.
Unfortunately, many of these testosterone-choked dudes would rather cut off their own nuts than ever apologize, especially to some batty boys, so they have to stay the hell out of my hometown.
Comment / By Max Garrison / March 4, 3:45 p.m.
This is all well and good, but the fact remains that this is Humboldt County, and not Jamaica. There would be no out lash towards the gay community even if these artist had been able to perform. Whats more is that Jamaican reggae artists ostracize themselves and look silly when they perform these type of lyrics in California. I’ve seen it happen. I know that the threat of violence shouldn’t be protected by free speech, but it seems foolish of the gay community to think that people attending a reggae show would be so simple-minded that they’d act out against other community members just because of lyrics.
Comment / By Mitch Trachtenberg / March 4, 4:34 p.m.
Max,
Reading the article above, does it bother you that these artists are urging “torture, mutilation, and murder” of gay people? Even if they only voiced those views in Jamaica, where their views are more popular?
If someone came to town urging the “murder, mutilation, and torture” of all black people, would you think to yourself, “Well, it seems foolish of the black community to protest, because here in Humboldt, people attending their concert wouldn’t “act out against community members?”
Or would you think, “wow, how incredibly disgusting.”
How would you feel if a promoter, all sweetness and light, explained that the artists’ justification (with no evidence as far as I know) was that they’d once been molested by one black person?
How would you feel if a promoter, all sweetness and light, explained that it’s all a matter of point of view, and that these artists happened to believe in a book that says all black people are really mud people, punished with blackness for their various sins? (No, that book is not hypothetical.) And how would you feel if the promoter suggested that you are intolerant because, after all, the artist’s sacred book tells them to murder, mutilate and torture black people?
How would you feel if a promoter, all sweetness and light, said that an artist had apologized, when it’s in black and white that they hadn’t?
Just wonderin’.
Comment / By Sac-Town / March 4, 7:06 p.m.
Mitch, go jump back in your mama and learn some sense
Comment / By Max Garrison / March 4, 7:33 p.m.
Mitch,
Your questions are quite silly, they barely deserve a response, but since you seem so mislead I feel it necessary to give you a reality check. You seem to be trying to get my emotions going so I approach this in an irrational way. You really think that these artists are coming here to “urge torture, mutilation, and murder.” Do you realize how dumb that sounds? Bounty Killer, Capleton, Sizzla, Elephant Man and Buju Banton have all performed in Humboldt County in the past. Please show me any hate crimes that were directed towards the gay community in response to those shows taking place.
You’re acting like the main message that these artists are pushing in their stage show is “murder, mutilation, and torture” Not so.
Do you think that there would be a festival as long lasting as reggae on the river, or one as well attended as reggae rising is if they had artists performing such a violent set?
They have their views, and while you and your ilk may not find them as dignified as your cause, expecting them to censor themselves is just as foolish as me asking you to apologize for the expression of your sexual preference.
Comment / By Mitch Trachtenberg / March 4, 8:09 p.m.
Max,
Those quote marks around “torture, mutilation, and murder” meant that I was quoting the author of the article.
As I’ve pointed out at other times and other places, the hate crimes don’t need to happen in Humboldt to be worth protesting — they happen regularly in Jamaica.
Me and, I would guess, my ilk, don’t particularly care whether they censor themselves — we just need for the wider community to know who they are. Now, at least to some extent, it does.
Comment / By Max, you’re missing the point / March 5, 7:46 a.m.
The last couple years of gay activism against murder music around the world has been a complete success.
Call it the “buju rule.” If an artist calls for the death of gay people, then no legitimate business in the entertainment industry is going to want to be associated with them.
I have no doubt that the Nocturnum would have turned away Skrewdriver, the skinhead band who calls for attacks against black people, right? Nor would Goldenvoice, EMI, or any multi-national corporation promote them.
What’s the difference between Skrewdriver and Buju? Not that much.
This is equality—and more importantly, this will save the lives of gay lesbian people around the world, as the braying jackasses calling for our execution are marginalized, at least until they renounce violence against gay people and make amends for their words.
You, Max, secure in your hetero privilege, are so quick to dismiss the gay community’s concerns over being hunted to death. Don’t you understand that’s what happens to us? Across nations, cultures, and eras, straight people get their jollies by lynching gay people. And we take that seriously.
So I commend the Humboldt based human rights groups who won this important battle against this nasty hatred, and will do what i can to support you in the future.
Comment / By Ras mike / March 5, 10:02 p.m.
Bottom line is the lyrics are a modern day twist of a biblical tradition that says gays must be put to death. Why don’t you guys go after the local Church’s and try to ban the bible as hate speech.The bible and it’s message are protected and it calls directly for the killing of gays .Except for a few extremists ,people don’t act on it. That is what max is saying ,it is a expression of disgust ,not a call to arms. why don’t you go after the right wingers and leave the poor black man alone.Even the aclu supports buju’s right to free speech.
Comment / By Mitch Trachtenberg / March 6, 7:46 a.m.
Calling for hanging, throwing acid, getting out Uzi machine guns and automatic weapons is not just an “expression of disgust.”
Songs that get sung by joyous, dancing crowds outside homes in which gay people have been killed are more than “expressions of disgust.”
Comment / By Max Again / March 6, 2:03 p.m.
So the point that I’m missing is that gays have been victims through the ages, some gays are insecure with who they are, and they don’t like to hear others talking bad about them…..
It seems to me that hate crimes directed at gays have been going on long before Buju recorded ‘boom bye bye’. They are not going to stop just because you all are successful in getting shows/tours canceled. Sorry.
Screwdriver/skinhead music is not the same as Buju/reggae. Just look at the people that attend the shows. No I am not talking about skin color.
For the record, Yes I’d find it lame and offensive if there were anti-black performances going on in my town, but you know what, I can chose to not go, as can you. I don’t have agree with/condone everything that is said by everyone in my town, and neither should you.
As long as you all keep convincing yourselves that the main objective of artists like Capleton is to promote violence against gays, no one will convince you that your fight is misdirected, which it is.
You all need to get over yourselves and go after something that will get to the root of the hate. There’s no dignity or virtue in fighting music.
Comment / By Mitch Trachtenberg / March 6, 2:40 p.m.
Max,
No one cares if singers wish to sing about how disgusting they find us. No one has suggested that Capleton’s main objective is the promotion of violence against gays. Personally, I just want to make sure that these artists’ audiences are clear on the artists’ lyrics, which clearly call for the murder and torture of people. It’s called “owning what you say.”
http://www.amnestyusa.org/lgbt-human-rights/country-information/jamaica/page.do?id=1106567
Comment / By Max Garrison / March 6, 3:31 p.m.
No Mitch, it is clear that what you are making sure is that these artists don’t even get to perform. If you just wanted to inform the audience, then pamphlets would suffice. I have been knowingly listening to this so called ‘murder music’ for over 10 years, I am still yet to have the desire to kill any gay people.
It was you that asked me this: “does it bother you that these artists are urging “torture, mutilation, and murder” of gay people?” Your use of the word “urging” suggests that you feel that the focus of his stage show is violence towards gays. So you should own what you say.
You are not protesting hate crimes by keeping music from playing, what you’re doing is censorship.
Comment / By Max Garrison / March 6, 3:58 p.m.
By your line of reasoning you could fight inner-city poverty by protesting rap artists that have songs about having to hustle drugs in their ghetto to survive.
Comment / By Mitch Trachtenberg / March 6, 4:22 p.m.
OK Max, you’ve completely lost me. I use the term urging because when a performer gets on stage and sings something like kill battyman, I take that to be “urging.” I’m happy to own that.
I doubt very much that continuing this dialog is going to change either of our minds, or the minds of anyone else reading along. I wish you well.
Comment / By Max Wins / March 6, 5:37 p.m.
You can’t change my mind because I’ve already thought of the arguments you and your ilk have presented… I try to see it from your view. I read the info from link to the Amnesty International page. There is nothing on there about canceling the international tours as a way to fight the homophobia present in Jamaica.
Too bad that some of you all don’t see yourselves as valuable members of the community. You have a lot to offer, don’t take that for granted, and don’t take the rest of the community for fools in thinking that they’d suddenly turn into anti-gay lunatics because of a stage show. As harsh as it is, I think you should take the advice of sac-town, because when presented with the arguments that I have made you either resort to making issue of quotation marks, or you just quit.
Comment / By Mitch / March 6, 8:21 p.m.
I am jumping back into my mama to learn some sense….or maybe i will jump back into papa
Comment / By Hank Sims / March 6, 9:45 p.m.
Haha! Mitch wins!
Comment / By Ras mike / March 6, 9:56 p.m.
Mitch,is the bible protected speech and does it not call for the death of gays? If the bible and church is allowed to speak the message then shouldn’t paraphrasing be protected? as i said before why don’t you go after the local churches and after the bible, as it is the source of the expression being spoken.my take is that we have laws to protect anyone from violence and anyone who hurts a gay can be arrested. that is why words are words and actions are actions.
Comment / By Ras mike / March 6, 9:56 p.m.
Mitch,is the bible protected speech and does it not call for the death of gays? If the bible and church is allowed to speak the message then shouldn’t paraphrasing be protected? as i said before why don’t you go after the local churches and after the bible, as it is the source of the expression being spoken.my take is that we have laws to protect anyone from violence and anyone who hurts a gay can be arrested. that is why words are words and actions are actions.
Comment / By Ras mike / March 6, 10:02 p.m.
Mitch,actually you needed a mama AND a papa to be here. Maybe you should see that reality and the beautiful balance between a man and a woman and how together they can make a sacred life and love. It’s a blessed thing ,I wish you could know the joy.
Comment / By Joel Mielke / March 7, 9:52 p.m.
“…is the bible protected speech and does it not call for the death of gays?”
So if hate speech is tolerated in one place we should tolerate it everywhere? What a pathetic argument.
“…actually you needed a mama AND a papa to be here”
Speak for yourself.
Comment / By Mitch Trachtenberg / March 8, 8:49 a.m.
Joel etc…,
Deuteronomy 13:12-17 is pretty severe with, say, Hindus. Maybe with Rastas, too, depending on how you interpret the ideas about Haile Sellase.
“If you hear in one of your cities, which the LORD your God is giving you to live in, anyone saying that some worthless men have gone out from among you and have seduced the inhabitants of their city, saying, ‘Let us go and serve other gods’ (whom you have not known), then you shall investigate and search out and inquire thoroughly. If it is true and the matter established that this abomination has been done among you, you shall surely strike the inhabitants of that city with the edge of the sword, utterly destroying it and all that is in it and its cattle with the edge of the sword.
Then you shall gather all its booty into the middle of its open square and burn the city and all its booty with fire as a whole burnt offering to the LORD your God; and it shall be a ruin forever. It shall never be rebuilt.
Nothing from that which is put under the ban shall cling to your hand, in order that the LORD may turn from (V)His burning anger and (W)show mercy to you, and have compassion on you and (X)make you increase, just (Y)as He has sworn to your fathers…
Comment / By Ras Mike / March 11, 6:23 p.m.
Cartoon makes no sense! The point in the thread was that it take a man and woman 2 make a baby and the guy thinks I am saying something about raising a child as a single parent! I was the one who made the point that Rasta is a judeo-christian based faith that gets it’s ideas about homosexuality from the bible, so as long as the bible is legal under free speech,the music should be legal. I was saying I find it interesting the gays target reggae artists.Black people who were the ones who suffered for the civil rights we all enjoy instead of going after our local churchs.Go down to St.bernards and protest.Maybe you leave them alone cause they secretly like gayness like you. Whats next ,horror movies?Did you go kill after you saw natural born killers?
Comment / By Mitch Trachtenberg / March 12, 10:52 a.m.
Archbishop Desmond Tutu, in Washington Post, March 12, 2010:
Hate has no place in the house of God. No one should be excluded from our love, our compassion or our concern because of race or gender, faith or ethnicity — or because of their sexual orientation. Nor should anyone be excluded from health care on any of these grounds. In my country of South Africa, we struggled for years against the evil system of apartheid that divided human beings, children of the same God, by racial classification and then denied many of them fundamental human rights. We knew this was wrong. Thankfully, the world supported us in our struggle for freedom and dignity.
Comment / By Thirdeye / March 13, 1 p.m.
As much as I love to stick my fingers in the eyes of stinking hippies, I have to side with them on this one. Lots of lyrics are offensive, advocating antisocial behavior and even violence. Such lyrics are protected free speech, and that is a good thing. That includes misogynist, violent rap lyrics. That includes Meg Christian’s lyrics about “fighting back.” That includes the lyrics of Skrewdriver and other skinhead bands. Gay lyrics are offensive to fundamentalist Christians. Once we ban performers because of lyrics offensive to a particular group, we are on a slippery slope.
The line between speech that is protected and illegal is quite clear. Anybody can vent their bile on stage. Nobody can incite specific acts of violence. Buju at the Nocturnum would be within his rights spewing his hate unless he started singing about, say, going to Mitch’s house after the show.
The limit of what is acceptable at a particular venue is up to the individual owners. They may, in good conscience, disagree with anyone about what is acceptable on their stage. That is their right. To harangue them over such disagreement is pointless and counterproductive.
The ultimate test of community standards for art is its economic viability. The millions of dollars generated by the pornography industry show that it is, throughout much of the world, a community standard. If Buju’s lyrics don’t deter reggae fans from supporting his shows, they are a community standard. If an interest group or venue owner has a more restrictive standard than the community standard, that is their right. The difference is that a venue owner has an economic incentive to meet the community standard.
The true battle is for hearts and minds. Picking this particular fight is a copout that will not convince anybody and will protect no one from violence.
Comment / By Mitch Trachtenberg / March 13, 1:55 p.m.
“The ultimate test of community standards for art is its economic viability. ”
Exactly right, thirdeye. And as long as newspaper columnists refer to people who punch out and kick the mothers of their children in public streets as having “domestic violence beefs,” people won’t know enough to choose how they spend their money.
It’s a very simple fight, thirdeye, and it’s not with the artists, who at least stand behind their words. It’s with the venue owners, the promoters, and the columnists who all pretend that calling for the execution of a group of people isn’t all that bad.
Comment / By Mitch Trachtenberg / March 13, 2:09 p.m.
The thing that is so truly nauseating about this issue is precisely that no protest should be necessary.
In December 2009, Beenie Man did a concert in Uganda and sang a song calling for slitting the throats of all gay people.
If it weren’t for newspapers willing to take advertising for such events, venues willing to take money for renting their space, promoters willing to claim that the singers are just saying what the Bible says, and columnists willing to consider whether the artists aren’t “victims”; in short, if it weren’t for money and greed on the part of a bunch of Americans, these artists would have NO audience here.
Comment / By Joel Mielke / March 14, 4:20 p.m.
I’m disappointed that Ras Mike didn’t get the cartoon, but when he writes things like, “so as long as the bible is legal under free speech,the music should be legal,” I’m not surprised.
Nobody is trying to criminalize your numbingly repetitive music, we’re just saying that if some of these oafish bigots book shows in Humboldt, we’ll be there to protest. Nobody is taking away their right to free speech, or yours.
Comment / By Joel Mielke / March 14, 4:57 p.m.
Here’s some humor that perhaps even Ras Mike might enjoy.
Comment / By =) / March 15, 12:46 p.m.
mitch- are you talking about censorship?
Comment / By =( / March 15, 3 p.m.
Try reading the thread, happy face.
Comment / By Ras mike / March 15, 3:54 p.m.
It’s not that i didn’t get the cartoon,I just thought is was dumb and took what I said out of context. FYI ,i am a Rasta but I don’t have dreads and happen to be a Mexican, not a white hippy. the basic thing I see you trying to do is be little Rastas character to try to discredit My ideas. When I was a youth in san Diego , there was a place called soma , it was a warehouse concert venue.One night you would have a black punk group like bad brains and the next night some racist skinhead group and the next night some new wave thing or even a gay club night etc.The venue allowed for free speech and did not have to agree with the messages of the artists.There was no need for protest by or against gays.Rastas were not lined up protesting them.and gays were not protesting the skins ,nor were the anti racist skins!(sharp). You could use the punk movement to see how censorship , in any form , is crap.
Comment / By Ras mike / March 15, 3:55 p.m.
It’s not that i didn’t get the cartoon,I just thought is was dumb and took what I said out of context. FYI ,i am a Rasta but I don’t have dreads and happen to be a Mexican, not a white hippy. the basic thing I see you trying to do is be little Rastas character to try to discredit My ideas. When I was a youth in san Diego , there was a place called soma , it was a warehouse concert venue.One night you would have a black punk group like bad brains and the next night some racist skinhead group and the next night some new wave thing or even a gay club night etc.The venue allowed for free speech and did not have to agree with the messages of the artists.There was no need for protest by or against gays.Rastas were not lined up protesting them.and gays were not protesting the skins ,nor were the anti racist skins!(sharp). You could use the punk movement to see how censorship , in any form , is crap.
Comment / By Ras mike / March 15, 4:08 p.m.
The promoters should rise up and book the artists that the people want to see. it is a fact that Sizzla buju or capleton can sell out any venue in the county so I say give the people what they want!Let the protesters protest. I here some gays have pepper sprayed a Buju show and that is where it becomes a problem.The protest should be kept outside and peaceful
Comment / By Jonny Red / March 15, 4:17 p.m.
I would have liked to seen the ‘open dialogue’ meeting head at a neutral location rather than a place known to be a gay club.
Comment / By Gay violence / March 15, 4:24 p.m.
I found that link and though the lbtg’s deny it , it seems pretty obvious that someone gay or pro gay, did the act.I know this is an isolated incident and so is violence toward gays.the very vast majority of people who love dancehall reggae and dont like gays,will not do anything to a gay. they don’t want to go to jail or to go to hell so most just stay away. http://blogs.sfweekly.com/shookdown/2009/10/fans_pepper_sprayed.php
Comment / By Mitch Trachtenberg / March 15, 5:43 p.m.
This issue is really incredibly simple and straightforward.
A very small number of performers have risen to prominence, in part, by calling for extermination of all gay people.
When someone calls for the extermination of others, most people with a shred of decency don’t want to be associated with that person.
Associating with the bigots is a way that some Humboldtians make money. So those Humboldtians and their allies have tried to minimize, deny, and explain away the call for genocide.
1, 2, 3. Very simple, and it has nothing to do with reggae, gays, censorship, or musical taste.
I’ve learned some things in the past few months. The most basic is that some people will say anything for a buck. The next most basic is that there are people here in Humboldt whose idea of tolerance is welcoming those who unapologetically call for genocide.
4:24 — an irresponsible reporter initially blamed a well-known drag queen for that pepper spray incident in SF. When the drag queen turned out to be able to prove they’d had nothing to do with it, the paper added the sentence below — please note where the “misinformation” came from:
“An earlier version of this story mistakenly identified Pollo Del Mar and other LGBT activists as being responsible for the incident, based on misinformation from Banton’s management. SFWeekly regrets the error.”
Comment / By Joel Mielke / March 15, 6:56 p.m.
I don’t get what you people are whining about. Your bigoted clown-musicians can bray against gays all they want, just don’t expect us to welcome their sorry asses when they play here.
Would you deny us the right to protest their performances?
Comment / By Ras mike / March 15, 9:45 p.m.
AGAIN, DO YOU GUYS READ THE THREADS? I SAID SOME BASIC THINGS :IF THE PEOPLE WANT THE MUSIC , IT IS NOT THE PROMOTERS FAULT AND THEY SHOULD BE ABLE TO RENT A VENUE OUT WITHOUT IT BEING A ENDORSMENT OF THE ARTIST VIEWS. THIS IS HOW IT IS DONE IN COUNTER CULTURE VENUES WHERE TRUE FREEDOM IS ALLOWED AND YOU GET A FULL VARIETY OF BANDS FROM RACIST SKINHEAD MUSIC AND THE NEXT NIGHT SOME HIPHOP ARTIST BRINGS A MOSTLY BLACK CROWD AND THE NEXT NIGHT SOME GAY CLUB DOES THERE NIGHT THERE.THERE ARE NO PROTESTERS BECAUSE THE SAME IDEA OF NON CENSORSHIP IS WHY THE GAY NIGHT IS ALLOWED TO HAPPEN.I WILL HOLD FIRM ,WORDS ARE WORDS AND ONLY ACTIONS SHOULD BE STOPPED.FREE PASSAGE MEANS THAT GAYS OR RASTAS OR WHO EVER SHOULD BE ABLE TO ATTEND THEIR EVENT AND THAT PROTEST SHOULD NOT DISRUPT PATRONS PEACEFUL ASSEMBLY
Comment / By Ras Mike / March 16, 7:23 a.m.
Mitch, I find it odd that the only buju show ever to be pepper sprayed was in S.F. and a bunch of gays were there protesting.Seems pretty obvious who did it.Just because the tranny denied it dosn’t mean it was a lie. Since when do you ask the criminal if they did the crime and accept their answer as the truth?
Comment / By Mitch Trachtenberg / March 16, 9:33 a.m.
Ras Mike,
I have no idea who released pepper spray at the concert. It certainly didn’t help the protesters’ cause. And it didn’t happen until 12:30 in the morning, an hour after the protest was over. If it was a protester who released pepper spray, all they did was hurt those who oppose murder music.
In the start of the article below, from the CBS affiliate in SF, you’ll notice that the booker for the Rockit Room had a different take on things than Traci McGregor, who profits off Banton. McGregor wasted no time deflecting attention.
Here’s the start of the article:
“A release of pepper spray scattered fans at reggae artist Buju Banton’s concert in San Francisco early Tuesday morning.
“It happened just before 12:30 a.m., about an hour after a group of protesters finished a demonstration outside the club, said Ben Thompson, booker for the Rockit Room club.
“Police were not called. It is still not clear who sprayed the gas.
“”Nobody saw who did it,” said Thompson. “For all we know, it was a Buju fan who was there.”
“Most people were unaffected by it, said Thompson. “Within ten minutes, everyone was back up there dancing and listening to the band.”
“Banton never stopped playing, said his manager, Tracii McGregor.
“”Don’t know who the culprit was, but clearly it was someone trying to ruin the show,” said McGregor in a series of text messages to CBS 5.
“”It was a hairy moment for the band, but it was fine,” wrote McGregor. “Nobody panicked, which made all the difference.”
Comment / By Mitch Trachtenberg / March 17, 8:35 a.m.
Those who defend the rights of people to call for genocide should take note of this week’s common sense court ruling:
“a message that threatens physical harm, even if it wasn’t meant to be serious, loses its First Amendment protection”
From today’s San Francisco Chronicle:
Threatening posts not protected free speech
Bob Egelko, Chronicle Staff Writer
Wednesday, March 17, 2010
A state appeals court says a 15-year-old boy whose Web site was flooded with anti-gay slurs and threats can sue a schoolmate who admitted posting a menacing message but described it as a joke.
In a 2-1 ruling Monday, the Second District Court of Appeal in Los Angeles said the violent language of the message - threatening to “rip out your … heart and feed it to you” and to “pound your head in with an ice pick” - conveyed a harmful intent that is not protected by the right of free speech.
The dissenting justice, Frances Rothschild, said no one who read all the messages posted on the Web site - in which youths tried to outdo the others in outrageous insults - would interpret any of them as a serious threat.
The case is one of the first in California to examine the boundaries between free expression and so-called cyber-bullying. The court majority said a message that threatens physical harm, even if it wasn’t meant to be serious, loses its First Amendment protection and can be grounds for a lawsuit.
Comment / By Joel Mielke / March 17, 8:37 a.m.
So, do Rastafarians believe in the magic powers of all caps?
Comment / By Mitch Trachtenberg / March 17, 12:34 p.m.
Can’t blame Ras Mike for trying, Joel.
Comment / By Joel Mielke / March 18, 1:21 p.m.
Oh, I can blame him for trying. I can also blame him for his utter lack of logic.
Comment / By Thirdeye / March 18, 9:07 p.m.
Nothing new in the court ruling and it has no bearing on the issue at hand. Personally threatening speech is not protected. It’s the difference between singing about killing battyman and singing about killing Mitch.
Comment / By Mitch Trachtenberg / March 18, 10:54 p.m.
Thirdeye,
Here’s part of the majority opinion from the Supreme Court, in Virginia v Black:
“True threats” encompass those statements where the speaker means to communicate a serious expression of an intent to commit an act of unlawful violence to a particular individual or group of individuals. See Watts v. United States, supra, at 708 (“political hyberbole” is not a true threat); R. A. V. v. City of St. Paul, 505 U.S., at 388. The speaker need not actually intend to carry out the threat. Rather, a prohibition on true threats “protect[s] individuals from the fear of violence” and “from the disruption that fear engenders,” in addition to protecting people “from the possibility that the threatened violence will occur.” Ibid. Intimidation in the constitutionally proscribable sense of the word is a type of true threat, where a speaker directs a threat to a person or group of persons with the intent of placing the victim in fear of bodily harm or death. Respondents do not contest that some cross burnings fit within this meaning of intimidating speech, and rightly so. As noted in Part II, supra, the history of cross burning in this country shows that cross burning is often intimidating, intended to create a pervasive fear in victims that they are a target of violence.
Comment / By Thirdeye / March 18, 11:04 p.m.
Nice cut and paste. Now, does knowing that nasty lyrics might be sung to a bunch of stoners who don’t care at the Nocturnum place you in fear of bodily harm or death? My point stands.
Comment / By Mitch Trachtenberg / March 19, 8:42 a.m.
Third,
I believe that words matter because they have the potential to lead to actions, whether by the speaker or by the listener. Is your argument that words don’t matter, and therefore Nocturnum should not face interference in their attempt to make money off of bigots singing hate to a bunch of stoners who don’t care?
I’ll take my argument, thank you. You can keep yours.
Comment / By Joel Mielke / March 20, 1:38 p.m.
“My point stands.”
Congratulations.
Comment / By freemen 911 / March 20, 11:26 p.m.
I hope you guys know these new “laws ‘ about free speech are post 911 laws that go along with things meant to clamp down on decent and are part of the new world order
Comment / By freemen 911 / March 20, 11:32 p.m.
You can no longer say something like “those ……( who ever ), need to blow up this evil country” This is the reason for the law, no to protect gays or kids.
Comment / By South africas mitch? / March 21, 12:38 a.m.
Now I see it. Still trying 2 control black people, huh Mitch?
Comment / By WTF / March 21, 1:23 p.m.
Poor Freeman South Africa. That guy needs a tutor.
Comment / By wtf……wtf! / March 21, 9:57 p.m.
Better than a diaper like you!
Comment / By wtf……wtf! / March 21, 9:58 p.m.
Better than a diaper like you!
Comment / By ouch joel ! / March 21, 10:09 p.m.
Does Lynn know you sneak out to Moe’s some nights for a quick walk on the wild side?
Comment / By Joel Mielke / March 22, 8:42 a.m.
So the ganja really sharpens your wits, eh?
Comment / By Then you could use some, Joel / March 28, 11:30 a.m.
Your stupid cartoons contain no wit. They’re just the same digs at Eureka over and over again. Fuck you.