John Thomas 
Member since Jul 11, 2008


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Re: “Where To Now?

longwind

"Why doesn’t that include a certain potrepreneur whose personal investment in a failed campaign resembles Meg Whitman’s?"
Because he didn't fight against re-legalization, of course. I have no problem with the many growers and dispensaries who did not oppose Prop 19. They had enough ethics to realize they need to change their business so it doesn't rest on the persecution of millions of innocent Americans.
:Why are his ulterior motives off-limits, while many thousands of people you don’t know anything about are ‘greedy’?"
For the same reason as above. Again, it is not the "greed" that bothers me. It's the blind, callous greed that caused many growers to oppose the people's legislation to end the fraudulent marijuana prohibition.
"Maybe you’d better just punch back into the Oaksterdam business office and file for awhile. It’ll ground you in something real."
I'd love to work there. But it's not possible, thanks.
"Those who fought against it” wanted freedom for marijuana, not just Oaksterdam"
Baloney. They didn't want freedom at the cost of losing their outrageously exorbitant prices.

Posted by John Thomas on 11/18/2010 at 1:29 PM

Re: “Where To Now?

More Reality

"Oaksterdamn et al want to exploit the bejeezus out of marijuana’s illegality in other states, as well as its would-be fuzzy legal status in California, as they’re currently doing. They want to grow exponentially more marijuana themselves in california, and take full advantage of people who can’t in other states."
And I suppose none of the other growers would do the same if they were in his shoes. This is a capitalist system. There are winners and losers. If you prefer some other system, work to change it, or move somewhere that has something closer to what you want. I'm not interested in what you think are Lee's "ulterior motives." I'll go with the information from the horse's mouth. Ultimately, it didn't matter who sponsored it, or any of the fuzzy details. This initiative may have been started by Lee, but it soon belonged to the people. It was a natural move based on many years of growing support and successes of marijuana reform. It would have freed marijuana consumers. Those who fought against it were very misguided or blinded by greed.

Posted by John Thomas on 11/17/2010 at 11:05 PM

Re: “Where To Now?

reality

"Two neighbors get along great for decades, then there’s an election and one of them has a sign with the name of a candidate the other doesn’t like in his yard. Suddenly, the one neighbor believes the other to be responsible for widespread suffering and their friendly ties are severed forever."
Two candidates running for office is a far different scenario than voting on whether to re-legalize marijuana or not. There can NEVER be any justification for voting against ending the persecution. Nobody's income that's built on that suffering is worth preserving.

Posted by John Thomas on 11/17/2010 at 10:54 PM

Re: “Where To Now?

what?

"please describe the “grow industry” as you put it, as well how proposition 19 came to be."
I'm not here to write an essay. Ask me a specific question, and I'm happy to answer it. longwind
"Anyone prejudiced enough to believe that growers mostly hiding under rocks changed the outcome of the election even here in Humboldt, let alone statewide, would obviously rather have scapegoats than understanding."
It wasn't just growers, of course. It was dispensaries, all the businesses that support them, and all the people whose real estate soared in value - not just in Humboldt, but all over the state. Bigots dislike people for who they are. I dislike people who do bad things. That's not bigotry. That's valid moral discernment.
I’d say Richard Lee set himself back by writing such a self-interested pander to any power that might give his business plan a leg up."
What's wrong with him making some money from risking millions of dollars? As we see, now all that money spent yielded him nothing. That's entrepreneurship.
"His initiative kept putting people in jail, remember?"
Not responsible adult consumers and vendors. Perhaps the punishment was too severe for older minors, but it's clear that with re-legalization, the whole climate would be changed and the hysteria drained out. I doubt if cops would spend any time chasing 20-year-old tokers.
Once again, Prop 19 would not have cast marijuana policy in stone. It would have been just the beginning. Policy would continue to be fine-tuned until it reached its optimum form, just like we did with alcohol after ending ITS prohibition.
Because of those against 19, we now have to wait another two years to make that beginning. Thousands of people will suffer needlessly because of that.

Posted by John Thomas on 11/17/2010 at 10:50 PM

Re: “Where To Now?

It appears you don't read the mainstream media, since, as already noted, they were on YOUR side against Prop 19. The people are what I'm all about. And protecting them from greedy growers who fight to continue their persecution is one of my principle focuses. The greedy growers have set marijuana reform back TWO YEARS for cruel, selfish purposes.

Posted by Johnas on 11/17/2010 at 11:59 AM

Re: “Where To Now?

Tom Johnas No. The mass media was on your side, of course. They were parroting your overblown charges of Prop 19 being badly written. You shouldn't diss your allies like that. I have been discussing/debating marijuana policy on the Internet, in the best forums since 1996. What those around me say is clearly important. That does not mean I can't, or shouldn't expose dishonesty or faulty logic when it's appropriate. I always will. The truth is marijuana reform's best friend.

Posted by John Thomas on 11/16/2010 at 11:36 PM

Re: “Where To Now?

Neither "you folks," nor "voters aren't ready," nor "the growing industry has turned its back, etc." constitute bigotry. They are simple, objective observations.
You need to get a dictionary. Continue or not. The truth remains.

Posted by John Thomas on 11/16/2010 at 2:51 PM

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